[geeks] Big Blue Smoke

[Eric Dittman]

> the problem here is your definition of web page. modern web applications 
> are built on a multitude of various servers and services. this is 
> largely the result of java's (ahem) bloat, but now a "web server" is 
> just that -- it streams text files over port 80. i cant give you all the 
> definition of servlet, portlet, server pages, application servers, 
> services servers, and all that other hooey, but the idea is you have 
> servers that are designed for the task. a netra is an excellent 
> webserver. we use dual or quad processor 280Rs for our application 
> servers, and also for our database servers. all told, what the public 
> sees as our "web server" is really a collection of probably 30 machines 
> on 4-5 racks (i'm not sure whether to count storage here).

With a z800 everything can run on one system.  I define a
web server differently, I guess.  To me all the bits that
are required to serve that page are part of the web server,
since if they aren't there the request fails.

> we get between 6-10 million hits a day, and we're looking to double or 
> triple that come june (going live, new site, new product, and so on...).
> 
> > If the code is written so it can't thread across multiple
> > systems, and you need more CPU than one system has, then
> > the load balancer won't help.
> 
> web servers dont use more than one cpu. read from $file, print to 
> $socket. no big deal.

Again, our different definitions of "web server".

> > No, but seeing pictures of data centers is interesting.
> 
> yep. i'll be getting pictures this coming week and posting, fer sher.

Don't forget to post the links.

> > If they've got data to back up the request, then there's
> > a reason they are asking.  If they've got money to back up
> > the request, that's even better.
> 
> i think this, and the above, is the crux of this argument. i agree with 
> you that for large multithousand-user applications should live on large 
> capable servers. a rack-o-netras is not appropriate for that. i dont 
> think im picking at nits or being pedantic when i say that what you 
> suggested -- using a database for a farm of web servers -- is not what 
> you are now saying.

No, we have just been using different definitions of what a
web server really is.  Like I pointed out earlier, if the
database isn't available, the request fails, so the database
is part of what I consider a web server, even if it runs on
a different system/partition.

> > I was so bored one weekend out of town I watched
> > "Titanic".  I was hoping Billy Zane's character
> > would kill that Leonardo shithead, but at least
> > he became a popsickle.
> 
> heh, my girlfriend at the time wanted to watch that movie. so i agreed 
> to go on one condition: that she let me sleep through the movie and just 
> wake me up when leonardo dies.

I remember reading an interview with some teenage girls
that kept going back to see the movie.  One of them
said she wanted the movie changed so Leonardo doesn't
die.

The stupidest thing I heard from a teenager at a
movie was during "Apollo 13".  One teenager leaned
over to another and asked, "do you think they make
it home?"
-- 
Eric Dittman
dittman at dittman.net
Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/