[geeks] Followup on weapons seizure

[Chris Byrne]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: geeks-bounces at sunhelp.org 
> [mailto:geeks-bounces at sunhelp.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Guarnieri
> 
> > I'm assuming that was said for effect, being substantially 
> identical to
> > one of the proposals of Strom Thurmond during the 1948 presidential
> > election.
> 
> You don't like gun banners, yet you seem well acquianted with their
> tactics, but I won't consider it too bad of a smear.
> 

I don't like anything banners. And yes Im very familiar with their
tactics. know your enemy as you know yourself - Sun Tzu

>  It is a serious proposal. We test foreigners coming to this
> country before giving them the ability to vote. How many 'native-born'
> Americans do you know who could pass the citizenship test?
> 

Honestly, very few. I'm extremely well informed, well read, and a hitroy
nut to boot and if I didn't do a refresher study I might not be able to
today.
Hell for most Americans the first time they'd ever HEARD of the
electoral cllege since high school much less understood anything about
it was the 2000 election.


> 
> How and why would someone opt out of receiving protection from the
> armed forces, one of the few legitimate functions of government?
> 

As I said I don't think it's possible. And I wouldn't do it anyway. I've
stated on this list before that I believe the only legitimate purposes
of a central government are as follows

1. Common Defense i.e. the military
2. the regulation and promotion of international trade including tariffs
and trade agreements/treaties
3. The regulation and promotion of interstate commerce and uniform
commercial trading and standards
4. The promulgation of the rule of law through the enforcement of full
faith and credit and the arbitration of legal disputes between
jurisdictions

That's it. 4 things. There should be a small tax levy on all citizens to
provide for the common defense, legislative and executive infrastructure
and the federal judiciary. There should be almost no federal beyrocracy
and wht there is should be self supporting through fees and the levies
and tariffs it collects.  

That was essentially the situation we had until the civil war. In the
period from the civil war til world war two our federal government
became a behemoth. It took Lyndon Johnson to make it the monster we have
today. 

Note that until the civil war a southerner was more likely to refer to
themselves as a resident of their state than as an American. Northerners
were more likely to refer to their nationality, but also maintained a
strong patriotic feeling to their states. After the civil war that all
changed. Nationalism was encouraged while federalism was effectively
eliminated.

The United States is not, and never has been a democracy. The Unites
states is a representative federal republic. For the last 140 years the
federal part has meant less and less as the republic part has come to
mean more and more. 

And honeslty I think in many ways this makes sense. It is extremely
inefficient to have separate governemnts for each state with differing
laws, structures, practices, executives etc... We essentially have 50
small but substantially independent countries gathered in federation.
This is not a great way to govern. That being said I think the USA is
too large to be governed as a single entity. The regional interests are
far too disparate.

Chris Byrne