[rescue] SPARCEngine 1E and VME Memory Boards

Tue May 24 01:01:55 EDT 2022

It is a VSB cable. It is mandatory to be used in Sparcengine 1e memory as
well as sun3e.

I am little bit surprised that 1e has detected the sun3e memory board over
vmebus only.

On Tuesday, May 24, 2022, Richard <ejb at trick-1.net> wrote:

> So thank you for the pointer and in a classic RTFM moment…:-)
>
> In the !E CPU Card Users Manual Section 17, page 137, (its a matter of
> reading a few pages I guess)
>
> <snip>
> The SPARCengine 1E P2 Bus is unique to the SPARCengine 1E. It is not
> compatible with the P2 Bus on any other Sun Microsystems card products. Use
> of the Sun Microsystems P2 bus for development is discouraged by Sun
> Microsystems, who reserves the right to re-configure the P2 Bus of each
> product related. The p2 Bus Is not documented for public use.
> </snip>
>
> Well thats handy! And then the killer
>
> <snip>
> While the SPARCengine 1E card family will work in a Sun-3E compatible
> back-plane, Sun-3E parity memory cards are NOT supported in a SPARCengine
> 1E system
> <snip>
>
> It says "not supported” but does that mean it might work, just don’t call
> Sun if it fails…kind of not supported or literally absolutely will never
> work kind of not supported…..hmmm
>
> So even if I had a 1E memory card (I had one on order that was refunded as
> they couldn’t find it) I still probably wouldn’t be able to use it as I
> have a Schroff I/O board for my P2 connector and not a Sun one…
>
> Off to go play with my SS1000 and do the memory upgrade I have been
> putting off for over a year.
>
> In the mean time….anyone found a SunOS 4.0.3e or 4.1e OS tape kicking
> around?
>
> Cheers
>
> Richard
>
>
> On 24 May 2022, at 11:05 am, Richard <ejb at trick-1.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Ethan
>
> Super interesting. Do you have any reference material for that?
>
> The only reference I have is http://www.bitsavers.org/
> pdf/sun/sparc/800-8137-02_The_SPARCengine_1E_CPU_Card_Users_
> Manual_Apr90.pdf and from what I can determine it doesn’t mention or
> elude to any of the below…then there are the FE manuals but they don’t talk
> much about this either.
>
> I have to say this is one of the more challenging bring backs I have done
> for a while.
>
> Richard
>
> On 24 May 2022, at 10:53 am, Ethan Hawke <ehawk at ember.systems> wrote:
>
> The 1E uses the SBus as it's main system bus, and uses the S4-VME chip to
> interface with the VME bus as an IO controller not as memory.
>
> In regards to the connector, the P2 connector is the second (lower)
> connector on the VME backplane, the unused outer row of pins on the P2
> connector is used as the memory interface on the 1E. So the cable would be
> installed behind the backplane (like you would a paddleboard), while the
> pinout on the 1E's P2 is provided on the 1E manual, I don't have a copy of
> the 1E memory manual to find the pinout of the P2 connector on that (or the
> registers for the memory controller on board the memory expansion card). So
> to expand the 1E you will need a 1E memory card, and the correct backplane
> cable to connect them.
>
> As for mapping generic memory cards, that will be quite tricky, while you
> can use the /dev/vmea32d32 interface to talk to it, to use it as memory
> would require modifying the OS and OpenBoot to add the correct ranges to
> the 'available' attribute. However it won't be cacheable and will hurt
> performance.
>
> If any one has a copy of the 1E Memory board user manual that would be
> helpful.
>
> So if you want to expand the memory on a 1E, you will have to find a
> memory board and create the special cable, I can only assume that it's a
> straight through cable, but besides from that I don't know the details.
>
> Cheers,
> Ethan
> On 5/24/22 07:43, Richard wrote:
>
> Hi Ethan
>
> Thanks for that…..
>
> The sun 3e boards don’t have a special cable https://shrubbery.net/~
> heas/sun-feh-2_1/Systems/Sun3/FEH3.enter.html I have the 501-8031 . The
> Sun 4e memory boards don’t have any special cable either 501-8042/501-8036
> /501-8060 https://oldcomputers-ddns.org/public/pub/rechner/
> other_hardware/sun/sparc_4-330/sun-4x.pdf . They look very much the same
> :-/
>
> How would I map them manually? Any pointers/howto?
>
> FWIW in my SPARCStation 1 I have the SBUS memory expansion with a special
> jumper cable. That won’t fit on this board.
>
> Cheers
>
> Richard
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 23 May 2022, at 20:25, Ethan Hawke <ehawk at ember.systems>
> <ehawk at ember.systems> wrote:
>
> 
>
> Hey Richard,
>
> Unfortunately that is not how the 1E works. Only one of the special memory
> boards with the custom P2 cable will work.
>
> Do the sun 3e boards use a special cable or just the standard VME bus? If
> standard VME you can map them in manually but they will exist in IO (aka
> obio or "type 1") space and won't be cacheable.
>
> The custom P2 cable carries the remaining signals to detect memory space
> accesses similar to the 'SBus Expansion Connector" on SS1/SS2 to use the
> special SBus memory boards.
>
> Sorry to disappoint,
> Ethan
> On 5/23/22 17:29, Richard wrote:
>
> Sadly they are all I have…I was working on the theory that owners of the
> 3/E would have upgraded to the 4/E without issue.
>
> Much like the 3/260 to 4/260 upgrade I did back in the day. Remove old cpu
> board insert new COU board, install fresh OS and keep using all the memory
> boards etc.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 23 May 2022, at 17:11, Plamen Mihaylov <plamenspam at afterpeople.com>
> <plamenspam at afterpeople.com> wrote:
>
> 
> Hi Richard,
>
> Maybe there is incompatibility between 3E and 1E mem boards when they are
> stacked. Do you have 4E60-16 or/and 501-8060 to test ?
>
> Best regards,
> Plamen
>
>
> On Mon, May 23, 2022 at 9:46 AM Richard <ejb at trick-1.net> wrote:
>
>> Hi Plamen
>>
>> Manual indicates that multiple are supported
>>
>> http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/sun/sparc/800-8137-02_The_
>> SPARCengine_1E_CPU_Card_Users_Manual_Apr90.pdf
>>
>> See pages 36 and 37…..
>>
>> Richard
>>
>> On 23 May 2022, at 3:45 pm, Plamen Mihaylov <plamenspam at afterpeople.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Richard,
>>
>> I don’t sparcengine 1E is designed to handle 2 memory boards.
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Plamen
>>
>> On Monday, May 23, 2022, Richard <ejb at trick-1.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi folks
>>>
>>> Looking for some suggestions/guidance or help.
>>>
>>> I am Looking to add 2x 4Mb Sun 3/E memory boards to the SPARCEngine 1E.
>>>
>>> I do note that these are memory boards from the Sun3/E but am of the
>>> understanding that they will work.
>>>
>>> Reading through the SPARCEngine manual I have added the jumpers to my
>>> schroff Backplane to bridge slot 2 as this is empty - the sbus video card
>>> occupies the slot.
>>>
>>> Configuration is
>>> Slot1: SPARCEngine
>>> Slot2: jumpered and empty
>>> Slot3: 4Mb memory bord jumpered for 4-8MB
>>> Slot4: 4Mb memory bord jumpered for 8-12Mb.
>>>
>>> Now on post I don’t see the extra 8mb.
>>>
>>> Anyone got any ideas ? I read something about telling the nvram about
>>> the VME cards but not familiar with that process or how to do so.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance
>>>
>>> Richard
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
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